McCarthy Speaks on ABC Alice Springs Breakfast Show

STEWART BRASH, HOST: The Federal Government say they will help create a further 800 new jobs in bush communities across Australia through the fourth grant round of the Remote Jobs and Economic Development Program, the RJED. Now Minister for Indigenous Australians, Senator Malarndirri McCarthy made this announcement during her visit to Yulara where she met with RJED workers employed in tourism jobs with Voyages Tourism Australia. Now, we're told the new jobs will support essential services and local enterprise across remote Australia through the Remote Australia Employment Service regions. That's from the Dampier Peninsula in the west, in the Kimberley, right across the Territory to Cape York in Far North Queensland. Now, the government says more than 3,000 jobs have been created since the program commenced in late 2024. And the latest round continues progress towards creating 6,000 new jobs in remote communities by 2030. I spoke earlier to Senator Malarndirri McCarthy and asked her how many of these jobs would make their way to Central Australia in the Barkly.

MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY, MINISTER FOR INDIGENOUS AUSTRALIANS: There would be a large proportion in the Centre, in Barkly and I'm happy to get those figures for you once that's all collated, Stewart. There is a real focus with the Northern Territory receiving a large percentage of those jobs for obvious reasons. And of course, across the northern part of WA and Queensland

HOST: Now there are, as I said, 3,000 jobs already out there. The question which often I get asked is how sustainable is this? What happens when funding support finishes? Because this isn't never ending. This isn't money forever. What happens when the funding support finishes?

MINISTER: Well, it is incumbent on the Federal Government to be able to assist Australians wherever they are at any time of need. I think it's really important for your listeners to recognise that this was about correcting a real wrong in terms of the previous Community Development Program. One of the things we wanted to ensure with this, Stewart, was about having the complete entitlements that come with a good job with long service leave, annual leave, superannuation. This was critical, but it was also about assisting businesses to be able to not only employ, but to have extra resources to surround that employment and it will continue for as long as we need it to, in terms of these organisations across Australia. Of course, everything comes down to budget. I'm very confident that the Prime Minister is right behind the economic development of our remote and regional areas of Australia.

HOST: When you look at the number of Indigenous Territorians who are not in the workforce, I think only 33.5% of Indigenous working age population in remote NT is in the labour force, meaning 66.5% are not participating. How much a difference does this program make? Because we're talking about surely a drop in an ocean of underemployment or unemployment.

MINISTER: That's correct. It is one avenue that we have to look at, Stewart. But the other area is of course through skills and training, we're offering Free TAFE specifically for that reason. We've had thousands of First Nations people go through that. We have to look at other areas to provide this support. Remote Jobs isn't just the only area. We need to be doing it across the board.

HOST: With the RJED, the new 800 positions, they're not geographically located? This depends on which employers, which organisations wish to apply for them?

MINISTER: Geographically located? Do you mean with Central Australia?

HOST:I'm just trying to get an idea. If the 800, say there's only sort of two or three employers in Central Australia interested. They're not designated to regions is what I'm trying to find out?

MINISTER: No, this is really a case of businesses, organisations applying because they're interested to take it on. Businesses have to, organisations have to have an interest, a real interest, in wanting to do this. So, it is about making sure that they are able to employ people and keep people in jobs. This isn't just about turning up for a day or a month or a week. This is about consistency in employment.

HOST: You're with the Minister for Indigenous Australians, Malarndirri McCarthy. Can I return to something you and I have spoken about many times? The $4 billion ten- year remote NT housing partnership. You want it to deliver 2,700 houses. We know the NT want 10% of that figure for admin and more than $500 million for block servicing. Now we have a review in place. When will that review be completed?

MINISTER: It's a rapid review, Stewart. I met with the reviewers last week. They're actually in Central Australia at the moment, I understand, meeting with stakeholders. I think they're out there with the Central Land Council, full Land Council meeting, as well. This is what they're doing, going to Groote Eylandt and places. One of the things I've said to the reviewers that I'm really keen to see them provide some sort of advice to both myself and the Territory government on is how do we get past this block in terms of the way the money is spent? They can have a really good look at the program and they can certainly have a listen to the stakeholders and see what they want.

HOST: So, when will you hear back?

MINISTER: Look, I'm really hopeful to hear back by the end of the year, Stewart, without putting too much pressure on them. But I certainly would love to get a sense of where we're going so that we can go into 2027 fairly confident that we've got the program on track for the housing.

HOST: How will it be reconciled, what you and I have spoken about, what the Northern Territory Government want that 10% for admin, more than half a billion dollars for block servicing. How can that be reconciled under this review?

MINISTER: Well, that's going to be the challenge, isn't it, for the reviewers to be able to provide those options to us. I certainly have my view. I'm sure the Northern Territory Government has its and I'm sure the Aboriginal stakeholders at the table have theirs. That's why we brought these two reviewers in, to give us some sensible guidance through this.

HOST: Who's doing this?

MINISTER: Caroline Edwards is representing from the Commonwealth and Craig Graham from the Northern Territory Government.

HOST: You and I have spoken and you believe that 2,210 new houses would reduce overcrowding by 50%. Does that remain the figure you at least would like to see under this process? Because I know you said up to 2,700. That seems aspirational. Is the 2,210 what you'll accept under the review?

MINISTER: Look, we need to see the decrease in overcrowding, Stewart. It's as simple as that. And those figures tell us this is what we should be achieving. Now, if the reviewers come back and they have some other options of how we can reduce overcrowding, well, I'll certainly be keen to see that.

HOST: Also need to reconcile your statement, because you and I spoke earlier on. You said you didn't want the partnership agreement dollars be used for block servicing and paying NT public servants. Might you have to walk that statement back at some point, under this review?

MINISTER: It's important we've had this call together for this review. All of us recognise that we've drawn a line in the sand, if you like, as to what our positions are. And it is important that these reviewers, and it's a pretty heavy burden on them, but that they can give us some options. So, I look forward to really having a thorough conversation with you once they've delivered that review.

HOST: Who are the reviewers?

MINISTER: Like I said, it's Caroline Edwards from the Commonwealth, who's been, in terms of the Commonwealth, she's certainly held very senior positions in the Health Department and other departments with the Commonwealth. And Craig Graham has also been involved with Treasury in the Northern Territory.

HOST: Just a few weeks ago we heard from the Northern Territory Government, from Steve Edgington. Now, the NT claimed to have built 400 homes. $637 million spent. Now they say they've only been reimbursed for 61 million so far. Is that still the case? And why is that the case?

MINISTER: Well, what happens, Stewart, is when the Northern Territory Government completes any of its schedules, it does need to be checked through, in terms of the Commonwealth and then the money's delivered. The reason why -

HOST: Is that still the case, Minister? Is that still the case that they haven't been reimbursed that figure?

MINISTER: I would have to check on that figure. I haven't had a look at it lately, Stewart, so I'd need to check just exactly what they've received.

HOST: Time is against us. Can we talk about the NTRAI? In late October, some news outlets were reporting that your government modified the NTRAI agreement with nearly $80 million of that $842 million going to APONT for governance work. Can you just clarify? The way it was being reported was saying that you had changed the agreements midway through and given APONT that money. Can you just clarify is that or is that not the case?

MINISTER: When I came into the role as Minister for Indigenous Australians, one of the things that concerned me was the Closing the Gap and how there were no real penalties or levers to get states and territories to move. I was in charge of putting together the latest Northern Territory Remote Aboriginal Investment Agreement between the NT and the Commonwealth. And so, in that process I inbuilt the need to have Aboriginal organisations at the table, with the view that funding would also be looked at for them. So yes, that was established -

HOST: But just clarifying and time is really limited, sorry Minister. So, the $80 million was put aside at the very start of this process? This is not something you've penalised the NT Government with in more recent months?

MINISTER: Yes, I've seen that reporting. This was certainly something I've done and have been saying for the last two years.

HOST: But that reporting is not accurate. It's not something you did in October?

MINISTER: No, this year I didn't do it. The schedules have been drawn up but the actual agreement was signed, I think it was in February last year.

HOST: When you total it all up, there seems to be $39 million which is still not accounted for, either going to the NTG or APONT. Do you know where that 39 million is? Or what that's for?

MINISTER: There are still negotiations underway, Stewart, and largely around the law and justice component.

HOST: Will that go to the Northern Territory Government or will that go to NGOs, to ACCOs?

MINISTER: Well, like negotiations show, they're still negotiating all of that.

HOST: Where would you prefer it to go, given concerns you've raised about Closing the Gap targets in the Northern Territory Government?

MINISTER: Oh, look, hand on heart, I want to see Aboriginal organisations fully funded and resourced and if there's an opportunity to do that, I will find that.

HOST: Can we turn to remote policing under the NTRAI? $206 million. Are you happy with how the NT is spending that money? Now, remembering the agreement says the money should ensure remote Indigenous Territorians have equal access to policing services. Are you happy with how that $206 million is being spent?

MINISTER: Look, it's not about whether I'm happy or not, Stewart. I think it's important that safety is paramount for all people. When it's absent, people feel it and we've seen that in a couple of communities. I'm very conscious that Alpurrurulam has certainly been one that has been asking for a police station. I have written to the Chief Minister asking for an update as to why there isn't one. I've asked for a briefing from the Northern Territory Police Commissioner on what's happening with Alpurrurulam, plus other areas, and I look forward to receiving those briefings.

HOST: In your mind, should that NTRAI remote policing money be used to build a new police station at Alpurrurulam?

MINISTER: Well, clearly this is a responsibility for the Northern Territory Government, Stewart. We have provided them the funding. This is why I've written to the Chief Minister and asked for clarification as to what's happening.

HOST: But you would see that as one of the uses for this funding?

MINISTER: I'd like to hear from the Chief Minister and the Police Commissioner and make my own decision after that.

HOST: Very briefly, in the Sunday Territorian, a former member of Solomon, Dave Tollner, he blasted the housing partnership as failed policy, said 50 years of Land Rights had failed to deliver aspiration, business and home ownership for Aboriginal Territorians. Is he right?

MINISTER: He's incorrect. I think it's important for your listeners to understand that there is a lot of work going on right across the Territory with Indigenous businesses, with the Land Councils, trying to do what they can. It is complex, it is difficult. But people are doing the best they can.

HOST: Should we have more private house ownership? Should we have more private house ownership on Aboriginal communities? On Aboriginal land?

MINISTER: There can always be a balance, there should be a choice.

HOST: Is there any at the moment?

MINISTER: People can go through Indigenous Business Australia. There are at least 600 home loans across the country that Indigenous Businesses Australia has provided for First Nations families.

HOST: Should there be more Minister, and I've got about 10 seconds. Should there be more?

MINISTER: There should always be choice.

HOST: Final question. You got anything you want to raise with the Chief Minister?

MINISTER: Just what our preparation is for the next wet season and the work that is going on with First Nations organisations and local government councils.

HOST: Minister for Indigenous Australians, Malarndirri McCarthy.